Collie people, pedigrees

[RoughCollies]

I've been doing a ton of research on a lot of kennels and the pedigrees of the dogs in them. I am noticing an excessive amount of line and in breeding. Not in all lines, but many.

If I were trying to find a healthy (well tested, including DNA for CEA, CERF, OFA, and anything else in there), not inbred or too closely linebred, DEMODEX FREE (I've already been to hell and back there!), conformationally correct, with working ability rough collie, any ideas on lines to look at?

We're not planning on another one for several years as we've added a new addition this past year who's had her share of issues. She was severly demodectic and was inbred. We got her through a private adoption and love her to death. She's demodex free now and doing great. As a matter of fact, she's got her first rally trial coming up.

But anyway, I am just doing research now. We love our girls, but I really do want to be pickier this time around. Since Dixie was an adoption, it didn't matter where she came from or anything, but next time around, I want to really be choosey.

Any ideas or places to start would be great.

[sheplovr]

Rough Collies from N.Y or where are you from now? So, who says inbreeding and linebreeding are one of the same?

Inbreeding can produce freaks! Simply stupid to ever try or do with any breed period.

Line breeding no closer than third generation is to so called: Strengthen the lines your using or experminating with? Personally, I would never do it as when I need new lines I buy a new dog or pup. There is NO call to do either of this stuff.???????

[RoughCollies]

Rough Collies from N.Y or where are you from now? So, who says inbreeding and linebreeding are one of the same?

Inbreeding can produce freaks! Simply stupid to ever try or do with any breed period.

Line breeding no closer than third generation is to so called: Strengthen the lines your using or experminating with? Personally, I would never do it as when I need new lines I buy a new dog or pup. There is NO call to do either of this stuff.???????

Yep, we're in NY now. I know linebreeding can be done safely, but it just seems to be a constant thing in collies I am noticing.

[agilityk9trainer]

I used to know some collie lines, but knew them in the midwest better. Unfortunately, the breeder I really liked quite breeding. You're doing research, so I'm sure you'll find the breeder you're looking for.

[Spicy_VV]

Most purebred breeds came from inbreeding and many breeders continue to line or inbreed. I'm sure you can fine some pups from an outcross or very loose breeding if you continue to search. Have you tried the shows local to your area to meet some breeders. You might also want to look into healthy lines, with a line that is very healthy and inbred/linebred you are likely to have little to no health issues in your pup because the line does not carry these issues to magnify them in the line. Instead of simply trying to avoid specific forms of breeding you might want to just look for good breeders who's pups won't have demo or other health issues and not look so much at the pedigrees. If you see an inbreeding/linebreeding you can ask why that dog was used as a foundation dog and find out more about him/her and offspring. You want to find out as much as you can because that dog could have had a health or temperament problems which means your pup will likely have this. I'm not very familiar with collies so I really can't help. APBTs yeah, collies I'd like to learn myself because I like them a lot.

Here is a writing on breeding types
http://www.nylana.org/RRACI/brackett.htm

Rough Collies from N.Y or where are you from now? So, who says inbreeding and linebreeding are one of the same?

Inbreeding can produce freaks! Simply stupid to ever try or do with any breed period.

Line breeding no closer than third generation is to so called: Strengthen the lines your using or experminating with? Personally, I would never do it as when I need new lines I buy a new dog or pup. There is NO call to do either of this stuff.???????

It is for consistent production healthy dogs of similar temperament, drive, look, ect. It is not an experiment if you know the lines you are working with. If you don't know what you are doing it can be bad and would be experimenting. Some people hide problems via outcrossing but that doesn't mean these problems can't show up with the right or a wrong breeding if breeding unrelated.

I've replied to this sort of post before but as its mentioned I'll always continue to reply.

If an inbreeding or linebreeding produces a freak (whatever that may be) then there is something wrong there. To call it stupid and say no one should do it because you don't like it is not right. Some great dogs have come from inbreeding and line, it is how you actually get bloodlines to begin with and how breeds are created. If no one ever tried this stupid practive then a lot of breeds would not even exist today. I bet founders ended up with a lot more problems since they did not have our knowledge today too.

We can also not put every breed the same, there I breeds I would not inbreed and be very scared of linebreeding. Because they have weakness and a number of problems, especially problems that are not being tracked, not being shared from one breeder to another and ones that there is no test for. It is a huge risk to the litter.

http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/pictures/91191.jpg
GR CH UWP PR Matrix Trinity CGC DNA-VIP (http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/public/printPedigree.php?dog_id=91191)
Here is an inbred product from one of the most reputable APBT breeders out there. There are many inbred Pit Bulls yet they are not considered freaks. They are healthy dogs with stable temperament, beautiful conformation and proper drives. What more could you ask for? They nor their breeders should be faulted because they are bred a specific way. Actually their success is due to how they are bred because the genetics made the dog.