Science Diet

[MaryGrace]

Hi guys! I am wondering if Science Diet is a good brand or not. It gets very high ratings on those sites where people rate dog foods, and it seems pretty good. But I am wondering about the corn. It seems to have an awful lot of corn. I'm wondering if this is harmful? I currently feed my black lab Max Science Diet Adult Large Breed Lamb Meal/Rice Formula mixed with half a can of Science Diet Savory Chicken Entree. Is this acceptable or is Science Diet a bad food?

[skunkstripe]

Hi MaryGrace, I am not a dog food fetishist, but SD does not have a good reputation on dog boards. Dogs were not meant to eat corn. Corn is a cheap filler. It will not kill your dog, but it is like eating CapN Crunch every day instead of granola. Sort of.

Among the better brands are Canidae and Nutro, also Innova. There are more.

[lassie]

Hi is that Hills Science Diet that you are on about/???

[zoe08]

Like skunkstripe said Science Diet is full of corn which is used as a filler. I think that you will find a dog food without corn as the main ingredients a lot better. Your dog will poo less, you will be able to feed less, and usually their coat will improve a lot. I know that is how it was when I switched Zo from Purina to Nutro.

[Jake2006]

Don't know if this will help anyone, but before I was aware of this I used to feed petfood without thinking about animal testing -

'Pet' Foods and Animal Testing Policies
The companion animal food industry has become big business in recent years. The market is currently dominated by international corporations - such as Procter & Gamble, the makers of IAMS and Eukanuba - who ruthlessly conduct experiments on animals to try to give their pet food a competitive marketing edge.

Slick advertising campaigns that promote a caring image obscure a reality of suffering and exploitation. However, as these cruel and unethical practices are being exposed through the work of Uncaged and others, decent animal guardians are seeking out responsible companies who produce pet food without cruel and unethical testing regimes.

Uncaged is determined to work with other animal protection groups to persuade the companion animal food industry to clean up its act. Uncaged supports and promotes the BUAV's new No Animal Testing Pet Food Standard. For companies to qualify, they have to prove that neither they nor their suppliers are engaged in animal testing that harms animals: that means no invasive laboratory experiments or keeping animals in captive laboratory or kennel conditions for lengthy periods of time - conditions that cannot fulfil their physical and psychological needs.

Many animal food companies issue unreliable and incomplete statements regarding their testing practices and the conduct of their suppliers. You can therefore be assured that this recommended list of foods represents a reliable guide to non-animal tested products.


Recommended 'pet' foods
COMPANY TELEPHONE WEB/EMAIL
Arden Grange 01273 833390 enquiries@ardengrange.com
Burns 01554 890482 info@burns-pet-nutrition.co.uk
Europa Pet Foods Ltd
(Brands: Europa - please note: this is NOT Europa supermarkets)
0845 658 0987 www.europa-pet-food.co.uk
info@europa-pet-food.co.uk
Fromm Family Foods 01531 633 985 available from:
www.postalpetsproducts.co.uk
Naturediet 08700 132960 info@naturediet.co.uk
Pero Foods Ltd 0800 917 9697 www.pero-petfood.co.uk
sales@pero-petfood.co.uk
Top Number and Happidog 0800 0182955
Trophy Pet Food 01367 243434 www.trophypetfoods.co.uk
sales@trophypetfoods.co.uk
Vegecat/Vegekit 01424 427393 info@vegansociety.com

Some of these brands are available from www.veggiepets.com.


Brands to Boycott
As mentioned above, the main culprits for cruel and unethical animal testing are the major international 'pet' food businesses.

IAMS / Eukanuba owned by Procter & Gamble
Hills Science Diet owned by Colgate Palmolive
The majority of pet food brands available in the UK are produced by two animal testing companies - "Nestlé Purina/Friskies" and "Pedigree, Masterfoods (Mars Inc)."

Nestlé Purina/Friskies: Alpo, Bonio, Felix, Go Cat, Gourmet, Omega Complete, Proplan, Spillers, Vital Balance, Winalot.
Pedigree, Masterfoods (Mars Inc): Bounce, Cesar, Chappie, Frolic, James Wellbeloved, Katkins, Kitekat, Pal, Pedigree Chum, Royal Canin, Sheba, Techni-cal (US & Canada), Whiskas. Pedigree also manufacture Thomas rabbit food and Trill bird food.

NB Techni-Cal (Europe) although not owned by Pedigree, Masterfoods (Mars Inc) is still a company to boycott as they have not signed up to the BUAV No Animal Testing Standard.
So far, none of the supermarkets have pledged to produce their foods without unethical testing processes.

All the other brands of food have so far failed to sign up to the 'No Animal Testing Pet Food Standard'. This means they cannot or will not ensure that their products do not contribute to harmful systematic testing processes.

To encourage them to clean up their acts, ask them why they have not signed up to the 'No Animal Testing Pet Food Standard'. Please forward any responses to us at Uncaged.


'Pet' food content
The content of animal foods raises additional, difficult ethical issues about the use of animals. Included in our recommended lists above are vegetable-based foods and in the case of Vegecat, a supplement that provides felines with their essential nutrients that are missing from plant sources.

You may wish to visit the following websites to explore further information about natural diets for animals to help you decide what to feed your companion animals, though Uncaged does not necessarily endorse any statements therein:

www.rawmeatybones.com
www.barfworld.com

Compassionate Shopping Guide
The Compassionate Shopping Guide is a comprehensive guide to cruelty-free companies, shops and supermarkets.

To send for your copy, make a donation of £5 or more.

Related Links
IAMS index
IAMS action
IAMS exposé
Global Boycott P&G
Support for the campaign
See also:

A good site for information about natural 'pet' nutrition and health - www.shirleys-wellness-cafe.com/petallergies.htm
For further information about 'pet' food testing, visit the BUAV site at www.helpthedogs.org/campaigns/petfood.html

[Jake2006]

Oops I'm sorry I didn't realise it was that long -................
I bet I get my ears boxed now - LOL

[Becky]

SD Adult Original Formula (bolded ingredients make up the majority of the food):
Chicken, corn meal, ground grain sorghum, ground wheat, chicken by-product meal, brewers rice, soybean meal, animal fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols and citric acid), chicken liver flavor, vegetable oil, dried egg product, flaxseed, preserved with mixed tocopherols and citric acid, minerals (salt, calcium carbonate, potassium chloride, dicalcium phosphate, ferrous sulfate, zinc oxide, copper sulfate, manganous oxide, calcium iodate, sodium selenite), rosemary extract, beta-carotene, vitamins (choline chloride, vitamin A supplement, vitamin D3 supplement, vitamin E supplement, L-ascorbyl-2-polyphosphate (a source of vitamin C), niacin, thiamine mononitrate, calcium pantothenate, pyridoxine hydrochloride, riboflavin, folic acid, biotin, vitamin B12 supplement)

Note that the "chicken" may actually make up less percentage. "Chicken" implies that the food was weighed before it was dehydrated, so there probably (although not definately) is more "corn meal" (and other grains) than chicken in this food.

Brewers rice is a cheapo subsitute for other rice. It's often missing much of the nutritional value of other rice.

There's a generic fat source which could include 4D animal sources for it. It would be MUCH better if it was say... "chicken fat" or "turkey fat."

"Chicken By-products" can vary in nutritional value (because they are more or less inconsistent). They are not a real reliable source for protein.

Most of the information I posted I learned on Http://dogfoodproject.com and I highly recommend taking a look at it so you can identify good foods. There are also many other sites out there that can do the same thing.

HTH

[sheltieluver4]

Hi, well, I know of a brand that is really healthy. It is called Natural Balance. It's for a life stages, and it's all natural, there is no corn, I got a sample at Petco, so I'm going to try and see if Basil will like it better than Purina puppy chow. The brand NB says evrything is fresh, duck,potatoes, so maybe thats a brand you could consider:)

Though I hear it maybe a bit pricy, hope that gave you an idea though

Sheltie

[Cheetah]

It's not any more expensive than Science Diet and it is better quality. >^^;<

[MaryGrace]

I don't care about the price, just about the content of the food. Thank you for all the fast replies! I didn't know that Science Diet was one of the companies that cruelly tests the food on innocent dogs and cats. It really is shocking, as Science Diet is recommended by the vet, and is listed as one of the best premium dog foods. I was thinking about Eukanuba too, so thanks for warning me. I am considering Canidae and Nutro. Could you guys tell me some of the best premium foods? Thanks again for the help! :)

[Jake2006]

Hi, its ironic isn't it - the Kennel Club have been asked to make a formal protest to the Pet Food Producers, but so far they haven't even responded to any requests.

I recommend Burns -

As far as vets are concerned they are involved working with a number of animal food production companies - sometimes I think they view the much bigger picture, but as far as I'm concerned I don't want my dog to eat anything that another animal has suffered to produce.

That's my opinion and of course everyone is entitled to theirs - but I have worked previously in the pharmaceutical industry and so I've seen things from the other side.

[sheltieluver4]

It's not any more expensive than Science Diet and it is better quality. >^^;<
Which is better quality, SD or NB

[Georgia]

When people say that corn is bad does that mean to avoid corn "anything" on a label? I ask because we went to a store that carried some of the brands recommened in this post and I could have sworn that I saw corn on one of the labels. I don't want to name the brand since I'm not 100% of what the label said but I remember thinking "Gee, the web site this stuff was good but here I see corn in the top 3 ingredients".

[Becky]

Just a wild guess, but it was probably Eagle Pack Original... here's what the bulk of the food is made up of:
Pork Meal, Ground Yellow Corn, Ground Brown Rice, Chicken Meal, Oatmeal, Chicken Fat (Preserved with Natural Mixed Tocopherols and Citric Acid)

I'd be willing to be the majority of the food is made up of meat meals, not grains. Also, it's better than SD (IMO) because the meat sources are names as well as the fat. However, corn and oatmeal still make up a large portion of the food, which is why I prefer their holistic formulas. EP is a bit more grain heavy than say Innova or Canidae, but I had excellent results with their Fish formula... the reason I switched back to Innova is because I only have to feed 3.75 cups of food as compaired to 6... Maddi's not big on food, so the less I have to feed her (for the equivalent energy) the better.

ETA:
I believe there was another post about corn... but no, I do not view corn, in itself, as evil. It's not poison unless you have a dog allergic to it. If your dog isn't and you have no personal problem with corn then I wouldn't be afraid to buy food with it in it... I do avoid any foods that start with corn or have several corn products in it... or if the corn is accompanied by by-products or other, poorer quality (or even possibly harmful ingredients such as BHT) ingredients.

I do, however, encourage anybody interested in finding out more about what makes good or bad ingredients to go onto http://www.dogfoodproject.com

[Cheetah]

Which is better quality, SD or NB

Err... exactly what I said. The "IT" would be Natural Balance. The "SCIENCE DIET" would be Science Diet... >O.o< I don't think I can make it more clear than that, sorry.

[Jake2006]

I apologise for the length of this email - but I'm justifying my comments

I recommend Burns - devised be a veterinary surgeon - John Burns - you can see the site
Your Pet's Health and Nutrition...
Our pets form such an important part of our lives. Yet when it comes to nutrition and health, how do you make an informed choice over which pet food to feed your dog or cat?

How do you know what goes into the food?

John Burns BVMS MRCVS had the same problem when he was seeing dogs and cats in his veterinary surgery - what could he recommend as a natural food that matched his holistic approach to health and nutrition?

So John developed his own natural alternative - Burns Real Food for Dogs & Burns Real Food for Cats!

Burns Real Food was possibly the first UK produced pet food to be free of artificial preservatives, colours and flavourings.

Burns Real Food will naturally maintain a healthy immune system, coat and skin, digestive tract, skeletal, respiratory and nervous system. It is also suitable for use where holistic veterinary treatment is being used in the nutritional management of disease.

Our Guide to Natural Health Care explains the principles behind the food, and has lots of useful information on nutrition and health. You can download the Guide as a pdf file by following this link. Also available to download is the Burns product brochure

http://www.burns-pet-nutrition.co.uk/

Food Additives, Antioxidants and Preservatives.
The following is a description of food additives/preservatives found in pet food. They are not always named on the food. Sometimes the label may say 'contains EU approved antioxidant' or 'contains EEC permitted preservatives'.

Propylene glycol
It is very closely related to antifreeze. It is usually found in semi-moist foods to maintain the water content and texture. It has been suggested that it causes the destruction of red blood cells. Some studies suggest that cats can become addicted to food that contains this.

Propyl Gallate (E310)
This is antioxidant used to prevent fats and oils going rancid. It is found in chewing gum and meat products. It is banned from children's foods in the US because it is thought to cause the blood disorder methemoglobinemia.

Ethoxyquin
This is used as a preservative and is thought to be one of the compounds most likely to cause damage to animal health. Ethoxyquin was developed as a rubber stabiliser. The Department of Agriculture in America lists it as a pesticide. It has been implicated as a cause of many problems including cancer of the kidneys.

Butylated hydroxytoluene (BHT)
used as a preservative to stop fat going rancid. It has been implicated as a cause of bladder and thyroid cancer and damage to the liver.

Butylated hydroxyanisole (BHA)
also used as a preservative to prevent fat rancidity. Has been implicated as a cause of stomach cancer.

Feingold (1975) found that antioxidants BHA and BHT contributed to learning difficulties and hyperactivity in humans.

In Dr. Pitcairn's (DVM, PhD) Complete Guide to Natural Health for Dogs and Cats, he looks at some of the artificial colourings in pet foods. He states that similar dyes where banned from human foods in the 1970's. The example given is Red No.2 and Violet No.1, which appeared to be linked to cancer, birth defects and skin lesions respectively.

The Asthma and Allergy Research Centre on the Isle of Wight looked at the effects of food additives and colourings and behaviour. In children significant changes in behaviour were seen when the additives (E102, E110,E122, E124 and E211) were removed from the diet for as little as 2 weeks. Does your pet food contain brightly coloured pieces?!




Cereals
If your pet food states 'cereals' as a product, ask your self why? Why do they not tell you which cereals? This can be because the cereal content changes with the season depending on which is cheapest at the time.

Brown rice, oats, barley as unprocessed whole grains are high in nutrients and easily digested.

Wheat is much harder to digest than rice. Many dogs seem to be intolerant to wheat gluten. Because of this many pet foods are now wheat gluten free.


Meat content
Again if your pet food states 'meat' or 'animal' on the label, you have to ask why the company will not tell you which animal they are using?

By-products or derivatives. Many people believe that this includes beaks, feathers, hair and faeces, however, this is not necessarily true. They can include: brain, spleen, lungs, liver, blood and intestines. Poultry by-product may include feet and heads.

Chicken meal, Lamb meal etc. fresh clean meat which has been cooked, dried and ground.

How much meat is in your pet food?

For example:

If the label says 'Beef' then 70-100% must be beef.
If the label says 'Beef Dinner' then 10-70% must be beef.
If the label says 'Beef Flavour' then 0-4% must be beef
If the label says 'with Beef or contains Beef' then there must be at least 4% beef
If two or more main ingredients are stated e.g. 'Beef and Rice' then they must be 10-70% of the food (and each one must be greater than 3%)
(Burger and Thompson, 1994)


Other ingredients

Soya and other vegetable proteins are difficult to digest.

Dairy products are hard to digest. Lactose is the sugar present in milk. After weaning, dogs and cats have decreasing amounts of lactase (the enzyme needed to digest lactose). Therefore, ingestion of dairy products may cause diarrhoea and/or flatulence as the body has difficulty breaking down the dairy product. Dogs and cats should not be fed milk and cheese!

Sugars are sometimes added to cat foods as a flavour enhancer. Sugar and sugar products are not good sources of nutrition for cats, and can contribute to dental disease

Yoghurt is sometimes used for therapy of chronic diarrhoea in the mistaken belief that the bacteria contained in yoghurt (Lactobacillus acidophilius or Lactobacillus bulgaricus) will colonise the bowel and displace unfavourable bacteria.

Yoghurt has bacteriocidal properties in vitro (test tube) but not in vivo (in the body). Orally administered bacteria in yoghurt does not displace resident or pathogenic bacterial populations in normal or diseased intestines of any animal. The bacteria in yoghurt are generally acid labile (destroyed by the stomach acid), limiting the numbers surviving passage through the stomach. (Research originally published in the Journal of Small Animal Practice Vol. 35).

References:


BSAVA Manual of Companion Animal Nutrition and Feeding, First Edition, Edited by N.C. Kelly and J.M.Wills. Pub, BSAVA 1996.

Small Animal Clinical Nutrition, 4th Edition, By Hand, Thatcher, Remillard and Roudebush. Pub, Mark Morris Institute 2000.

Dr. Pitcairn's Complete Guide to Natural Health for Dogs and Cats, By Richard H. Pitcairn, DVM PhD, Susan Hubble Pitcairn MS. Pub, Rodale Press, Inc. 1995.